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Old 10-25-2011, 11:44 AM
Colonel Biggs Colonel Biggs is offline Windows Vista Office 2000
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Default Images jumping from page to page...

I am using Office 2000 (still -- but it works for me!). I create a lot of documents in which I import JPEG graphs, convert them to frames, and place them on the page with text. (My thanks go out to Suzanne Barnhill, who taught me this technique some years ago when I was writing a technical publication for publication.)



I am finding that when I use several graphs on the same page, the graphs have a tendency to jump to the next page when a graph is added. It is a very frustrating exercise. Some have told me that I shouldn't be using Word for doing this type of work, but that I should be using one of the publishing softwares that are available. I'm not sure that I really want to learn another software package, since Word has worked so well for me in the past.

I use the cursor to place the import of the picture; then encompass it with a frame; then format the specifics. Most of my placements are with respect to the Page option, as opposed to the Column (I work with columns a lot in my writing). I have tried the Lock Anchor option, but it doesn't seem to do the trick. The movement of the frames from one page to the next usually occurs when I am trying to place several pictures on the page.

Is my placement technique incorrect? Would a more recent version of Office assist in solving my problem? Or, should I simply take the time to learn a pubishing software (which one?), instead of trying to publish in Word?

Thanks in advance for any assistance.

Gordon Biggar
Houston, Texas
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Old 10-28-2011, 03:35 PM
Bobosmite Bobosmite is offline Windows 7 Office 2003
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I'm no expert, but I use Word in a similar way. I like to put my graphics inside text boxes so they can be positioned anywhere on the page regardless of cursor position. I use Word 2010 at home and Word 2007 at work, so I've noticed some differences in the handle documents and graphics. Specifically, the Order option which allows you to move boxes forward and backward on the page. Is it possible all the boxes think they're on a flat plane and they're just pushing each other off the page? Also, it might not be an issue in Word 2010...which is cadillac compared what it was ten years ago.

I hope this helps.
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Old 10-28-2011, 07:51 PM
Colonel Biggs Colonel Biggs is offline Windows Vista Office 2000
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Had not thought about using text boxes instead of frames. Frames allow one to position the picture/frame anywhere on the page, also. My problem seems to occur when I am using several frames on a page. I do not think that they are overlapping, but maybe Word 2000 is not that forgiving. Trying to move them back into place on the same page is a chore, since they keep jumping back to another page.

It is worth a shot, though, for me to experiment with text boxes instead. Of course, perhaps if I upgraded my software to something within the last decade might help, too! Thanks for taking the time to respond.

Gordon Biggar
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Old 10-28-2011, 10:02 PM
Colonel Biggs Colonel Biggs is offline Windows Vista Office 2000
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I've done some experimenting with the use of text boxes since the last post. I find that the positioning of the boxes is more stable than that associated with the use of frames, and that it is easier to position multiple pictures/boxes on a page.

Where I am running into difficulty, however, is when I am mixing text with the text boxes (containing pictures), where the text boxes consume an entire page. Most of my writing uses two columns for text with pictures scattered about. If I format the pictures to "Lock Anchor," and if I specify "Top and Bottom" for Text Wrapping, I don't have a problem with moving the pictures as I write or add text.

However, when I am adding text to a page that precedes a page that is all pictures, I find that the added text pushes the page of pictures onto the next page. The entire page of pictures is moved, not just the picture at the top of the page. I tried making the entire page a text box, and then inserting text boxes within that box to hold the pictures, but the same thing happened.

In a written document, one is always going back to an earlier section to revise text. If I could solve this part of the puzzle, I might have something!

Gordon Biggar
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Old 10-31-2011, 02:21 AM
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macropod macropod is offline Windows 7 64bit Office 2010 32bit
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Hi Gordon,

This is a known issue, and the only practical approach I've found is, as far as practicable, do all the text stuff first, then start inserting and positioning pictures from the front of the document. If you start adding/reformatting text after inserting the pictures, that may cause any pictures after the edited range to shift; the same applies to inserting new pictures ahead of any that have already been inserted. The alternative is to insert them in-line as you go, then change the wrap formatting once there's no more text editing to do before the images - and always work from the start to the end of the document.
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Old 10-31-2011, 07:07 AM
Colonel Biggs Colonel Biggs is offline Windows Vista Office 2000
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Sir Paul --

Thanks for your post. Inserting text boxes (or frames) after the text has been entered should no doubt work well for reasonably short documents. When writing 10-15 pages plus with lots of pictures/graphs, it might become a bit awkward. I presume that Word 2007/2010 have not addressed this issue either?

It's worth a shot on my shorter pieces, however. Thanks for the thought.

Gordon Biggar
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Old 12-02-2011, 09:33 AM
Ulodesk Ulodesk is offline Windows 7 64bit Office 2010 64bit
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Default Word and jumping graphics

Macropod is certainly correct, as is the person who originally told you that this kind of work is best handled by a page-layout application. The latter allows anchoring graphics as well as text--which is always created in a text box of some kind--to a precise location on the page, independent of other factors. I'm not up on freeware applications, but there are a number of inexpensive, Word-compatible ones, such as Serif's Page Plus (www.serif.com).
The issue then becomes whether you have a need to send documents in an editable format to someone else, since any such receivers may not have the software that can read the files created. PDFs can be created, however.
Switching to a page-layout program does require some learning curve. A professional design program like Adobe's InDesign has a very steep curve; something like PagePlus is made for the inexperienced but may have remarkable features for the price, and may serve you better in the long run.

Cordially,
Ulodesk
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Old 12-02-2011, 11:23 AM
Colonel Biggs Colonel Biggs is offline Windows Vista Office 2000
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Sir Ulodesk --

Thanks for your posting.

The purchase of Office 2010 did not solve the problem, unfortunately. A plus, however, is the ability to insert pictures and adjusting their sizes without having to use frames or PhotoShop.

One would think that Microsoft must be aware of the "movement" problem with multiple graphs. I will take a look at Serif's Word Plus; I experimented with Quark a few years back when I was writing a technical manual, but the learning curve was exceedingly slow (for me), so I made Microsoft Word "work."

Many thanks for your thoughts.

Gordon Biggar
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Old 12-10-2011, 02:15 PM
Ridgerunner Ridgerunner is offline Windows 7 64bit Office 2003
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Colonel: you're not the first to curse this MS office issue. The real answer is to use Wordperfect, but no one much does that these days unfortunately. I insert a LOT in images into office and just do a lot of adjusting when I'm done with all the text. It's a royal PITA for sure. Sometimes it's better to insert the image then size it down to 1 or 2" square, finish the text, then do your adjusting. That makes it a little simpler for me sometimes but it's still a lot of adjusting.
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Old 12-10-2011, 03:13 PM
Colonel Biggs Colonel Biggs is offline Windows Vista Office 2000
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Sir Ridgerunner --

I started out with Word Perfect in an earlier century. I never did like the transition over to Word, but I adjusted.

Someone earlier suggested that I enter all of the text first, then insert the pictures/graphs, starting at the front. I will try this where possible, but on long pieces it's not an option for me.

Thanks for your thoughts.

Le Colonel
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Old 12-11-2011, 01:22 AM
Ridgerunner Ridgerunner is offline Windows 7 64bit Office 2003
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Le Colonel: A fellow WPerfect junkie, eh? I agree. I still have it on several machines. It handles images... and everything else for that matter.... far better. I've been writing a technical report with inserted images all day today and after going back and adding/subtracting text my images are pretty scrambled. I won't even bother to fix them until I have the text done now.
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Old 12-11-2011, 02:35 AM
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macropod macropod is offline Windows 7 64bit Office 2010 32bit
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Colonel Biggs View Post
The purchase of Office 2010 did not solve the problem, unfortunately. A plus, however, is the ability to insert pictures and adjusting their sizes without having to use frames or PhotoShop.
You've always been able to insert pictures with or without frames and without using Photoshop.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Colonel Biggs View Post
One would think that Microsoft must be aware of the "movement" problem with multiple graphs.
I'm sure they are - and have been for years. I'm not sure what you think MS should do about it though, as there's really no way any application could know what the user intends to happen to content positioned after the point where an edit is made. If you want to be sure the layout of particular portions of the document don't change, you can always insert page breaks and/or Section breaks before them.
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Old 12-11-2011, 12:08 PM
Colonel Biggs Colonel Biggs is offline Windows Vista Office 2000
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Sir Macropod - Super Moderator:

I always appreciate follow-ups. Forums such as these, particularly going back to the earlier ones of years past, got me through the headaches of Windows 95, 98 et al.

It was Suzanne Barnhill (Word MVP) who suggested to me years ago (i.e., on the old Word forum) to use frames once I had inserted pictures. I was writing a book at the time on the overhaul of Model "A" Ford carburetors (late night reading only...), and was having a problem with the positioning of photos. I no longer recall the specifics of her suggestion, as it pertained to why frames, or why not.

My complaint with the jumping of images is a personal one, I suppose. My mindset says that once I place an image on the page, it should remain as postioned until I change it, resize it, or reposition it. Unless I want the image to be moved along with a specific paragraph, I'd like to have it remain in place.

When I am using only a single image on a page, I can live with the bumping, despite the inconvenience. It's when I have placed multiple images on a page that the frustration sets in. Where no text is being used in these instances, I will try your suggestion of using page breaks.

My thanks again for the time taken to respond.

Gordon
Houston, Texas
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Old 12-12-2011, 08:52 PM
Ridgerunner Ridgerunner is offline Windows 7 64bit Office 2003
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I remember. I started WP in 1989. It was ver. 5.1 back then. I still have the diskettes and the boxed set manuals right here on the shelf and I still have it loaded in a fully functional 15#Toshiba 3100SX laptop that has a little grey scale screen and has never once malfunctioned since 1989, and I have carried all over the globe from northern Alaska to the South Pole, in and out of helicopters and light planes and C-130's. You won't get that kind of life out of a laptop these days. It runs DOS 6.2 with stacker or Windows 3.1 flawlessly to this day and has an incredible bunch of software on it from Autocad 10 on down to Wordperfect, excel, Quatro Pro, Lotus, R base, Surfer, you name it... What a machine that thing is.

I was inserting an image into Word 2003 yesterday and it just disappeared. Looked down for a few pages then discovered it 2 pages up from where I put it. Go figure. It wouldn't come down so I resized it to very small and dragged it down to where we started. When I do that I usually insert it in the upper right or left hand corner then select it and grab a corner and resize it up to what I want, which usually works pretty well. You just have to make sure to select the "square" option in the image toolbar to get the text to wrap around the image. I haven't even tried this sort of thing in Word 2010 yet and am not anxious to do so.
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